Home > Featured News > Interview: Senator Dr. James Reilly

Interview: Senator Dr. James Reilly

Earlier this week, as his Autism Spectrum Disorder Bill passed through the Seanad, we sat down with Senator Doctor James Reilly to hear his thoughts on the Bill’s progression, its provisions, and what inspired him to legislate it to begin with. 


Well, maybe rather than answering that question directly, it might be easier for me to answer it this way. What first got me involved, in any form of politics at all, was Health Board, and that was the issue of Autism, because of my own son, whom I felt was not getting remotely the level of input that he needed. It just struck me that so many other kids had this problem and weren’t getting the services or the interventions that they badly need. So, I went for election on the Health Board, and I continually raised this issue. Now at that time, the Department of Education didn’t really believe that there was such a thing as autism, or at least the Department didn’t think that it needed its own specialised strategy for education. Autistic children were, at that time, being educated alongside other children who had emotional disturbances and it was doing neither group any good. I’ve had a lifelong interest since then, I was in the Irish Society for Autism and so, when I got involved in national politics, this was very much an area that I wanted to progress in.

Now, as Minister for Health, it wasn’t possible to progress it. The Department were against it and there was other opposition to it from different quarters. Sometimes as a government minister, you’re very hamstrung, whereas if you’re a backbencher or a Senator, you actually have more latitude. So I’m delighted to be in a position to have published this Bill, got it through the second stage, and hopefully, with support from my colleagues and Minister Harris, we will succeed in getting it through the Seanad before the summer and into the Dáil by the autumn.

To answer the implicit question, as to why is this necessary, it’s very clear that there isn’t a unified strategy, there’s no codified approach, that there isn’t a uniformity of service and that many parents feel isolated and somewhat abandoned in their struggle. Most people know the story of my son; from having been diagnosed as mentally handicapped and then not speaking until he was 5, not getting into a mainstream school until he was 11 years of age and then to studying a PhD in stem cell research in autism and to have this week an article published in one of the world’s leading scientific journals. Now that wouldn’t have been possible for a whole myriad of reasons, but what was so critical there were the interventions he’d gotten in his early years.

We all know it’s a range of things, again, like with my son who’d been lucky enough to excel to those who may encounter a steady stream of obstacles throughout their lives on living independently. But one thing that’s critically important to emphasis to those who mightn’t be familiar with autism: regardless of the child’s ability and or how profoundly that they might be affected by the condition, early intervention will improve the outcome and allow them to reach their full potential, no more than the rest of the population. We all have different potentials to fulfill.

So this Bill’s very different to another one that was put forward before in 2012, which only looked at adult needs. This one looks at adults and children, a continuum of care and a pathway for their development, their needs and the supports that their families need as well. It’s important to stress that this Bill’s about ensuring that there’s a strategy – it’s not about determining what that strategy should be – but it’s critical that people with autism and their families are heavily involved in enacting it.

I worked in St Ita’s Hospital, and there were many patients there with autism which were profoundly affected. I believe that many of them mightn’t have ended up there had we a more enlightened approach to autism when they were young children. For those who are at the more deeply affected end of the spectrum, we can certainly hope that they’ll lead much more independent lives nowadays. That they could be living in a sheltered accommodation, rather than an institution; they could be going to a sheltered workshop rather than an institution; to their benefit and to society’s benefit generally.

So, this Bill will allow for a strategy which, when implemented, will afford people with a clear pathway for ensuring that they get the support they need for their child, their parent and that’s ultimately to the benefit of us all.


Well if you look at the younger age group first of all, you can see straight away that there’s a mismatch between the educational facilities that are in place and the therapies required to get the best out of those. So we now have a situation where, from having a Department of Education that refused to acknowledge there was ever such a thing as autism, to now providing special classes and Special Needs Assistants (SNAs) to support them. Yet the HSE can’t equally provide the necessary supports in terms of speech and language therapy and occupational therapy. This clearly has to be addressed.

For older people living with autism, for the adults, it’s the ongoing support that can often be invisible, and they can often shy away into themselves. Third level education is a particular challenge in that regard, and whilst many of them are certainly able for the academic side, they aren’t for the social milieu if you like that very much is that time of life. When we’re all trying to discover ourselves and we’re all struggling identifying and re-identifying ourselves and making new friends and new connections, they can often get lost in all that. I mean, Trinity have put in place supports and I only spoke yesterday to Professor Brian McCraith from DCU, and they’re going to bring in the world’s first autism-friendly third-level campus, which delights me hugely.

I mean, I really think that it’s about enlightenment. We have to help the person with autism cope. The world won’t change to meet them. We may be able to achieve changes that will make life that bit easier for them, but ultimately, we’ve to help them cope with the environment that they find themselves in, just as we’ve to help all children and maturing adolescents.

So when it comes to the adults, what are the big challenges? Well, it’s about providing the appropriate educational supports in third level, in apprenticeships, in work experience, helping them become independent, making sure that appropriate accommodation is available.


For the Bill itself, it’ll be whether or not we’ll get a strategy, and of course we will, and then to be a matter of reviewing that strategy. That’s what I built into the Bill, there’re constant reviews of how it’ll be progressing because, just like everything else, life’s dynamic, and the world of autism is no exception to that. Different discoveries and changes come along. Sometimes in slow stages, sometimes in quantum leaps.


I believe there is, yes, and I want to thank all my Seanad colleagues for their unanimous support. I also want to thank Minister Harris for his support as well. I think that politics is about the art of the possible. We’ve managed to keep this apolitical and we have pretty widespread support. I should also say thank you to the 20,000 plus people online who’ve supported the campaign. I’ve asked them to continue supporting the campaign because it doesn’t end tomorrow or at the end of the week. It has to go on into the Dáil and I hope that we’ll have the same consensus there. We’ve to be especially mindful of the fact that there’ll be a lot of competing pieces of legislation going through in the autumn term, so we need to keep the heat on and that the work starts on the implementation strategy. Even thereafter, I think the campaign should continue on to support the strategy’s development and actual implementation.


Well, that’s the great challenge of autism, isn’t it? Axiomatic to politics are the challenges of being able to communicate effectively, of being able to network with others and influence their opinions and ideas. The former is a core deficit of autism, so obviously it takes tremendous effort to focus, to concentrate and be able to understand that politics is a language of so many different varieties and signals. That being said, I’ve no doubt that, with the right supports in place, individuals living with autism can get involved in politics and become tremendous advocates for the cause.


Well, look, is there every really enough? We have to operate within the resources that we have and there’s no doubt that we spend a great deal of money on disability if you look across all the various sectors. What’s maybe needed more of is more cohesion and coherence. That’s not to say money’s of no object, but what I’d like to see is closer cooperation between actors and advocates before we talk about how much money needs to be spent. I think what’s critical though, and this was something I was very proud to be associated with when I was Minister for Health, was our push and drive with Kathleen Lynch to ensure that the consumer – the actual person living with the disability – had a major say in what was to be provided, rather than the system we had in place previously which was effectively this is what we’re giving you and if you don’t like it, take yourself off somewhere else.


Of course they do. Ireland has a wonderful tradition in accepting difference in many respects; I mean, I remember when a house opened up in Lusk, far back as maybe thirty-odd years ago, and those who moved in were totally different from the resident inhabitants of the community. Yet they were welcomed with open arms and there’s always been that tradition of acceptance down the Protrane Peninsula of the needs of people with educational and mental health needs and of the differences people can have. Back in the old days, we’d have viewed this I suppose as ‘eccentrics.’ People looked out for them nonetheless, and that’s still there in our communities today. It may not be as evident sometimes because of nuclear family versus the extended family phenomenon, but I think that’s why it’s so important why we should have strong communities. Why we should all know one another and look out for those who are more vulnerable, help the individual who gets misinterpreted or who misinterprets other things.

by - 13 July, 2017

Last updated by - July 13, 2017

in Featured News, Interviews

Can this be improved? Contact webeditor@asiam.ie if you have any suggestions for this article.
You May ALso Like
Regional Group Dail Eireann Autism Bill

Explainer: What Did This Morning’s Regional Group Autism Bill Motion in the Dáil Mean?

by - 20 October, 2021

Minister for State Anne-Rabbite thanks Regional Group for motion and argues that more time is nee...[...]

‘Autism is not a health issue; it is a human rights issue’- Autism Bill to be debated in Dáil Morning of Wednesday 20th October

by - 19 October, 2021

The Regional Group of TDs intend to support and progress the Autism Bill through second stage dur...[...]

Reduced School Timetables

Latest Guidelines on Reduced School Timetables

by - 22 September, 2021

Last week, the Department of Education published the latest guidelines to provide clarity surroun...[...]

AsIAm adult wellbeing

Launch of AsIAm Adult Support and Wellbeing Programme

by - 16 September, 2021

Today, 16th September 2021, AsIAm is delighted to announce the launch of its new Adult Support an...[...]

AsIAm Launches Bridge Forward Programme

by - 3 September, 2021

Recently, AsIAm obtained funding from the Late Late Toy Show Appeal to the amount of €100,000 to ...[...]

AsIAm publish pre- budget submission for 2022 to the Government

by - 27 July, 2021

Ireland’s national autism charity are proposing ways the Government can achieve true inclusivity ...[...]

Autism Creative Writing

Fighting Words Fully Accredited As Autism Friendly

by - 9 July, 2021

Fighting Words is now an autism friendly organization, ensuring autistic youth nationwide will al...[...]

north wicklow educate together principal billy redmond autism friendly school management

Billy Redmond: Principal of an Autism Friendly School

by - 7 July, 2021

After talking to Lorraine Kelly of North Wicklow Educate Together School, we had a word with its ...[...]

Lorraine Kelly Autism Friendly Teaching

Autism Friendly Teaching: Lorraine Kelly

by - 21 June, 2021

After diagnostic or clinical supports, education is an institution which will take up the largest...[...]

covid-19 disabilities health education

Statement on impact of Covid on people with disabilities in health & education

by - 17 June, 2021

AsIAm Statement ahead of Dáil Debate on impact of Covid-19 on people with disabilities in health ...[...]

AsIAm report shows major barriers to services for autistic children & teens

by - 13 June, 2021

Every Child Counts Report shows two-thirds of respondents are dissatisfied with HSE services and ...[...]

AsIAm Career Opportunities

by - 28 May, 2021

AsIAm has endeavored to represent autistic people through our information resources, training pro...[...]

Father and child holding hands during walk. Start your Autism Journey with our resource

Resource Packs to help guide parents on the Autism Journey

by - 26 May, 2021

The national autism charity of Ireland, AsIAm in conjunction with the St. John of Gods Foundation...[...]

social care worker

Job Vacancy: Social Care Worker

by - 21 May, 2021

AsIAm is currently enhancing its service offering with the addition of an Autism Information Line...[...]

Adult Support Wellbeing

Job Vacancy: Adult Support and Wellbeing Officer

by - 21 May, 2021

The Role: AsIAm is currently developing a programme to address issues with regard to the lack of...[...]

AsIAm response to publication of the Senior Counsel Report relating to the whistle-blower allegations put forward in the recent RTE Investigates programme

by - 21 April, 2021

AsIAm, Ireland's National Autism Charity, has noted the publication of the Senior Counsel Report ...[...]

autistic students state exams receive examrevision membership for month of April

ExamRevision.ie Grants Free Access to Autism ID Cardholders

by - 9 April, 2021

AsIAm is pleased to announce that ExamRevision.ie, will be offering free access to holders of our...[...]

AsIAm United Nations

CEO of AsIAm Adam Harris To Address United Nations Observance of World Autism Day

by - 7 April, 2021

The CEO of AsIAm, Ireland's National Autism Charity, Adam Harris will address the United Nations ...[...]

Autism Innovation Strategy Ireland

AsIAm welcomes the commitment to develop an Autism Innovation Strategy in Ireland announced by Minister of State for Disability, Anne Rabbitte TD, today

by - 2 April, 2021

2nd April AsIAm, Ireland's National Autism Charity, has welcomed the announcement by Minister of ...[...]

Letter to Ministers Donnelly and Rabbite Regarding Dossiers Collected on Autistic Children

by - 26 March, 2021

We've written to Minsters Stephen Donnelly and Anne Rabbitte asking for an urgent meeting to disc...[...]

Statement on RTÉ Investigates Report

by - 25 March, 2021

AsIAm, Ireland’s National Autism Charity, is deeply concerned following the RTÉ Investigates prog...[...]

return to school

Disability & Carers Groups Secure Commitment From Ministers Foley And Madigan

by - 19 March, 2021

Groups highlighted to Ministers members anger and disappointment at being left behind in the retu...[...]

schools re-open

No consultation on changes to school re-opening plan that will negatively affect 20,000 children with additional needs – Disability and Family Carer Groups

by - 19 March, 2021

Representative groups waiting over a month for engagement from Government on special education is...[...]

New #ChildrensFuturesIRL campaign focuses on children’s right to an adequate education

by - 19 March, 2021

  New #ChildrensFuturesIRL campaign focuses on children’s right to an adequate education ...[...]

supplementary education

Explainer: Supplementary Education Programme

by - 19 March, 2021

What is this?  The Department of Education, along with relevant education stakeholders, has begu...[...]

return to special education

Partial return to special education ‘a mixed day’ for families – Disability, Children’s and Family Carer groups

by - 11 February, 2021

Seven leading advocacy organisations, AsIAm, Down Syndrome Ireland, Family Carers Ireland, Inclus...[...]

AsIAm & Rethink Ireland Partner to Support 3rd Level Autistic Students

by - 23 September, 2020

    Project develops quality online resources to help autistic students transition ...[...]

Football For All: Inclusive Sport in Ireland

by - 18 September, 2020

  Young people with additional needs have struggled during lockdown; along with the disru...[...]

Life Over Lockdown: Kevin Hanly

by - 18 September, 2020

Kevin Hanly – Being autistic and living through a pandemic!! COVID-19 has affected everyone’s li...[...]

Autistic Pride 2020 Part Three

by - 18 September, 2020

Apologies for the delay in getting to the next part! As you can imagine, a lot has been happening...[...]

Autistic families concerned about the return to school, survey finds

by - 18 September, 2020

Autistic families concerned about the return to school, survey finds 77% of families feel ...[...]

Assistive Technology Passport: A Promising New System

by - 18 September, 2020

Assistive Technology Passport; The Qualitative Research study  In 2016,  Enable Ireland and th...[...]

Autistic Pride 2020 Part Two

by - 17 July, 2020

We now move onto part two of the Autistic Pride Online coverage. Thank you for bearing with us. C...[...]

Autistic Pride 2020 Part One

by - 6 July, 2020

We hope you all enjoyed celebrating Autistic Pride 2020, especially our friends at Autistic Paddi...[...]

autism eating disorders

Autism and Eating Disorders: Sharlene Woods and Fiona Fisher Bullivant

by - 2 July, 2020

Experts have discussed the correlation between autism and eating disorders before. However, they'...[...]

Autistic Pride in Ireland

by - 18 June, 2020

Autistic Pride began in 2005 with a celebration by Aspies for Freedom. Since then every year June...[...]

Autism and College Drop Out

by - 11 June, 2020

 Between the sensory changes, new routines and demanding workloads, starting university can be es...[...]

autism air travel

Conor McDermott : Autism and Airports

by - 14 May, 2020

Conor McDermott has recently completed a research project for his undergraduate in Occupational T...[...]

AsIAm’s Open Letter to the Party Leaders

by - 6 May, 2020

AsIAm has written to the party leaders of Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, and the Green Party to stress t...[...]

Explainer: COVID-19 and Changes to Work

by - 20 March, 2020

UPDATE: changes have been announced to certain payments from the Government at this time of writi...[...]

Maintaining Calmness about COVID-19/Coronavirus in the Autism Community

by - 14 March, 2020

Michael Ryan – Counsellor/Psychotherapist While we cannot control the spread of this virus in th...[...]

autism friendly vodafone

Vodafone Becomes Autism Friendly

by - 5 March, 2020

We at AsIAm were proud to work with Vodafone Ireland to introduce autism-friendly retail hours in...[...]

Emma Davies Speech

by - 1 March, 2020

Emma Davies, a young autistic advocate and friend of AsIAm, recently delivered a speech to her sc...[...]

What I (Don’t) Know About Autism: An Autistic Review

by - 12 February, 2020

After all our press on Jody O'Neill's play, we couldn't wait to see the play ourselves. Our Vice-...[...]

Medb Lambert: What I Don’t Know About Autism

by - 8 February, 2020

I recently had the pleasure of sitting down with Medb Lambert, head of design for What I (Don't) ...[...]

What I (Don’t) Know About Autism: Jody O’Neill and Dónal Gallagher

by - 30 January, 2020

What I (Don't) Know About Autism will shortly begin its run in the Peacock stage in the Abbey. Th...[...]

What I (Don’t) Know About Autism: Matthew Ralli and Paula Mc Glinchy

by - 24 January, 2020

What I (Don’t) Know About Autism, a play written by Jody O’Neill, will soon hit the stage. The pl...[...]

What I (Don’t) Know About Autism: Shay Croke and Jayson Murray

by - 22 January, 2020

What I (Don’t) Know About Autism, a play written by Jody O’Neill, will soon hit the stage. The pl...[...]

What I (Don’t) Know About Autism: Eleanor Walsh Interview

by - 20 January, 2020

What I (Don't) Know About Autism, a play written by Jody O'Neill, will soon hit the stage. The pl...[...]

hannah gadsby gender autism

Hannah Gadsby, Gender and Autism

by - 10 December, 2019

On June 20th of last year, when Hannah Gadsby's show, Nanette, which explored gender politics and...[...]

National Gallery of Ireland Becomes Autism Friendly

by - 18 November, 2019

Last week the National Gallery of Ireland became the first cultural institution in Ireland to rec...[...]

Autism and Higher Education: Steve Silberman and Dr. Magda Mostafa

by - 25 September, 2019

AsIAm recently hosted an informal discussion for autism and higher education. The session began w...[...]

Dr. Gillian Smith on Autism Friendly Dental Practices

by - 6 September, 2019

Dr. Gillian Smith is a Bray-based dentist. She previously made headlines in 2012 when she won the...[...]

Community Voices: Nóra Nic Oireachtaigh and Bullying

by - 2 September, 2019

The following piece is the final piece in our series covering bullying and autism. The first part...[...]

Fota Wildlife Park recognised for commitment to autism inclusion

by - 27 August, 2019

The attraction has been accredited by National Autism Charity as an example of best practise in a...[...]

Community Voices: Autism and Bullying

by - 23 August, 2019

Hello all. If you haven’t seen our previous interview with Neil Kenny, I’d recommend checking it ...[...]

Explainer: New Rules for Irish Language Exemptions

by - 12 August, 2019

The Minister for Education and Skills announced a rehaul of the criteria for granting exemptions ...[...]

AsIAm and Supervalu’s Corporate Charity Partnership Earns Award

by - 2 August, 2019

Coming ahead of some stiff competition, AsIAm and Supervalu have won the Corporate Charity Partne...[...]

Bullying and Autism: Neil Kenny Interview

by - 30 July, 2019

In the wake of Joel Langford’s tragic death, I wanted to discuss the unique nature of bullying di...[...]

So You Want to Celebrate World Autism Month

by - 8 April, 2019

April is World Autism Month! That means many people will be talking about autism in the media, in...[...]

Majority of Irish Support Autistic People in Jobs, Schools and the Community, but Don’t Understand Autism Well, survey finds

by - 2 April, 2019

Irish people show strong positive support for autistic people in schools, employment and society ...[...]


Are You Ready to create your Autism Friendly Town?

by - 19 February, 2019

AsIAm and SuperValu were proud to partner with the community of Clonakilty in creating Ireland’s ...[...]

National Autism Conference 2018 Speaker Presentations

by - 26 November, 2018

It's been a month since our National Autism Conference in October, and we've received wonderful f...[...]

Autism Friendly Santa School

by - 24 October, 2018

*Due to the huge amount of inquiries we have had about our Autism Friendly Santa Training, we...[...]

Clonakilty an Autism Friendly Town: A First For Ireland

by - 16 October, 2018

SuperValu and AsIAm partner with the entire community of Clonakilty to secure fu...[...]

Stephen Shore Visits AsIAm and DCU

by - 5 October, 2018

Last week AsIAm was honoured to welcome Dr. Stephen Shore, noted autistic academic and speaker, t...[...]

The Clonakilty Commitment – Training Week!

by - 3 October, 2018

The town of Clonakilty in Co. Cork has undertaken a commitment to become fully Autism Friendly – ...[...]

What Strategies can I use for my Non-Verbal Child to ease their Transition?

by - 28 September, 2018

All autistic children experience challenges in communication. While many might have an extensive ...[...]

How Can I Apply for a Special Needs Assistant (SNA)?

by - 20 September, 2018

The National Council for Special Education (NCSE) has just completed a review of the Special Need...[...]

How can My Child Be Supported if They’re Having a Meltdown?

by - 20 September, 2018

Research continues to tell us that we must view ‘challenging behaviour’ as a way in which the chi...[...]

How can I Explain My Child’s Sensory Needs to their New Teacher?

by - 19 September, 2018

Your child’s teacher may already be aware of autistic children's sensory needs. However, if your ...[...]

What’s an Individual Education Plan (IEP) & how can I Set One Up for My Child?

by - 18 September, 2018

An Individual Education Plan, often referred to as an ‘IEP’, is a plan to support your child’s le...[...]

What can I Do if my Child Doesn’t Want to go Back to School?

by - 14 September, 2018

Dr Emer Ring is the Head of the Department of Reflective Pedacology and Early Childhood Studies a...[...]

How can I help Ease My Child Back into the School Routine from Home?

by - 11 September, 2018

We all struggle getting back into our regular routine after holidays and for autistic children, w...[...]

What Resources are Available to Support Families on their Transitions in School?

by - 7 September, 2018

There is a wide range of resources available to support parents and children on this exciting jou...[...]

Is it a Good Idea to Arrange a Meeting with their Teacher? If so, What Should I Ask?

by - 4 September, 2018

It is a really good idea and absolutely essential to arrange a meeting with your child’s teacher,...[...]

Are there Things I can do at Home to Prepare my Child for Starting School?

by - 31 August, 2018

Parents and families are preparing their children for school from the day they are born and not j...[...]

What are the Most Important Things to Consider when Choosing a School for my Child?

by - 29 August, 2018

Starting school is one of the biggest events in both a family member's and a child's life. All be...[...]

Kevin Hanley: Back to Routine!

by - 27 August, 2018

Returning to routine after a break can be a tough one to get your head around, especially after a...[...]

AsIAm CEO Speaks before the Oireachtas Education Committee

by - 27 June, 2018

AsIAm Founder and CEO Adam Harris called on the Department of Education to deliver training to te...[...]

Melissa Mooney: Autism is a Superpower!

by - 19 June, 2018

Melissa, a young woman living with Asperger's, talks about her experiences with her autism and ab...[...]

NCSE’s Review of Special Needs Assistants Explained

by - 31 May, 2018

This week, the National Council for Special Education (NCSE) launched its review into the Special...[...]

Interview: Jody O’Neill – Autism & Entrepreneurship

by - 4 May, 2018

Jody O’Neill is a young self-advocate attending Castletroy College in County Limerick. She has se...[...]


by - 25 April, 2018

Stimming (short for self-stimulatory behaviour) is a repetitive series of actions which an autist...[...]

Conducting Autism-Friendly Interviews

by - 17 April, 2018

Businesses have begun to recognise the valuable skills that autistic employees can bring to the w...[...]

Creating a Quiet Space

by - 16 April, 2018

Sensory rooms or quiet spaces are designated areas where autistic people can use to stim or retre...[...]

Create a “Social story” for your business or organisation

by - 15 April, 2018

Social stories are short guides of a particular situation, event or activity. They include specif...[...]

Positive progress made as Autism Bill passes through Seanad Éireann

by - 13 July, 2017

AsIAm Ireland has warmly welcomed the passage through Seanad Éireann of the Autism Spectrum Disor...[...]

Interview: Autism, Tipp G.A.A. and Me

by - 6 July, 2017

This week, we sat down with Kevin Hanly, a young man from Tipperary to talk about his experiences...[...]

Stepping off the treadmill: Getting a Diagnosis as an Adult

by - 10 March, 2017

A blog by Brian Irwin,  AsIAm Volunteer & Secondary School Speaker in the Cork Region [capti...[...]

Michael Ryan: Secondary School – Getting off to the right start

by - 1 September, 2015

Starting or returning to Secondary School can be a big change and a challenge for all students, h...[...]

President Michael D. Higgins becomes Patron of AsIAm.ie

by - 22 April, 2015

AsIAm.ie is pleased to announce that the President of Ireland, Michael D. Higgins, has kindly agr...[...]

Jonathan Victory: Aspergers Syndrome & Martial Arts

by - 5 December, 2014

Jonathan Victory shares his positive experiences of Martial Arts as someone with Aspergers Synd...[...]

Was this article helpful?